Do we have a definitive answer yet to the question about Entourage 2008 
and Exchange 2007 servers and services? Will the Entourage 2008 
application be able to natively access an Exchange server like an 
Outlook client? Will Entourage 2008 be a "native" client application 
for Exchange like Outlook (and not use POP3 or SMTP access, unless you 
want it to)?

Ian 
-- 
Ian Robinson, Belfast, UK
<http://www.canicula.com/wp/>

Ian Robinson wrote:
> Do we have a definitive answer yet to the question about Entourage 2008 
> and Exchange 2007 servers and services? Will the Entourage 2008 
> application be able to natively access an Exchange server like an 
> Outlook client? Will Entourage 2008 be a "native" client application 
> for Exchange like Outlook (and not use POP3 or SMTP access, unless you 
> want it to)?

Hi Ian!

What's your definition of "native"?

Microsoft has already confirmed new Exchange specific features in 
Entourage 2008, so we know it will interact with an Exchange server as a 
client. But Entourage 2004 is already an Exchange client that can access 
mail, contacts and calendars.

If you're asking whether or not Entourage 2008 will have feature parity 
with Outlook then you'll probably have to wait on that.

-- 

bill

William M. Smith, Microsoft Interop MVP - Mac/Windows
Entourage Help Page <http://entourage.mvps.org/>
Entourage Help Blog <http://blog.entourage.mvps.org/>

I'm specifically interested in knowing if Entourage will support RPC
over HTTP.  Does anyone know about that?
Thanks,
Alan


On Oct 8, 10:17 pm, William Smith 
wrote:
> Ian Robinson wrote:
> > Do we have a definitive answer yet to the question about Entourage 2008
> > and Exchange 2007 servers and services? Will the Entourage 2008
> > application be able to natively access an Exchange server like an
> > Outlook client? Will Entourage 2008 be a "native" client application
> > for Exchange like Outlook (and not use POP3 or SMTP access, unless you
> > want it to)?
>
> Hi Ian!
>
> What's your definition of "native"?
>
> Microsoft has already confirmed new Exchange specific features in
> Entourage 2008, so we know it will interact with an Exchange server as a
> client. But Entourage 2004 is already an Exchange client that can access
> mail, contacts and calendars.
>
> If you're asking whether or not Entourage 2008 will have feature parity
> with Outlook then you'll probably have to wait on that.
>
> --
>
> bill
>
> William M. Smith, Microsoft Interop MVP - Mac/Windows
> Entourage Help Page <http://entourage.mvps.org/>
> Entourage Help Blog <http://blog.entourage.mvps.org/>

Alan Septoff wrote:
> I'm specifically interested in knowing if Entourage will support RPC
> over HTTP.  Does anyone know about that?
> Thanks,

Hi Alan!

No announcement has been made about that but I would say "highly 
unlikely" since it already accomplishes the same result using WebDAV, 
which also works over HTTP 
<http://entourage.mvps.org/exchange/exchangeathome.html>.

Hope this helps!

-- 

bill

William M. Smith, Microsoft Interop MVP - Mac/Windows
Entourage Help Page <http://entourage.mvps.org/>
Entourage Help Blog <http://blog.entourage.mvps.org/>

On Tue, 9 Oct 2007 03:17:15 +0100, William Smith wrote
(in article ):

> What's your definition of "native"?
> 
> Microsoft has already confirmed new Exchange specific features in 
> Entourage 2008, so we know it will interact with an Exchange server as a 
> client. But Entourage 2004 is already an Exchange client that can access 
> mail, contacts and calendars.

Can it send and receive mail from an Exchange 200x Server by directly 
talking to the mailbox server using the same protocol as Outlook? Not 
via SMTP and POP3.

Ian
-- 
Ian Robinson, Belfast, UK
<http://www.canicula.com/wp/>

Ian Robinson wrote:
> On Tue, 9 Oct 2007 03:17:15 +0100, William Smith wrote
> (in article ):
> 
> Can it send and receive mail from an Exchange 200x Server by directly 
> talking to the mailbox server using the same protocol as Outlook? Not 
> via SMTP and POP3.

You mean MAPI then. If that's your definition of "native" then even 
Exchange Server itself may not be native at some point in the future. 
The MAPI protocol is one of the items that has been "de-emphasized" in 
Exchange Server 2007, which means it may potentially be phased out in 
some future version. 
<http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa997614.aspx>

Any limitations in functionality that you're attributing to the lack of 
the MAPI protocol are more likely attributable to a smaller development 
staff with much more limited resources working on Entourage.

Also, Entourage 2004 connects to an Exchange Server via WebDAV. That's 
not MAPI but it's also not POP3/SMTP and it's not IMAP.

-- 

bill

William M. Smith, Microsoft Interop MVP - Mac/Windows
Entourage Help Page <http://entourage.mvps.org/>
Entourage Help Blog <http://blog.entourage.mvps.org/>

On Fri, 12 Oct 2007 03:27:54 +0100, William Smith wrote
(in article <elXF#dHDIHA.3716@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl>):

> You mean MAPI then. If that's your definition of "native" then even 
> Exchange Server itself may not be native at some point in the future. 
> The MAPI protocol is one of the items that has been "de-emphasized" in 
> Exchange Server 2007, which means it may potentially be phased out in 
> some future version. 
> <http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa997614.aspx>

I know that. That's why I didn't write MAPI. But anyway, I'll probably 
be at the launch day event on 14th January at MacWorld. I'll find out 
then :-)

Ian
-- 
Ian Robinson, Belfast, UK
<http://www.canicula.com/wp/>

Ian Robinson wrote:
> On Fri, 12 Oct 2007 03:27:54 +0100, William Smith wrote
> (in article <elXF#dHDIHA.3716@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl>):
> 
>> You mean MAPI then. If that's your definition of "native" then even 
>> Exchange Server itself may not be native at some point in the future. 
>> The MAPI protocol is one of the items that has been "de-emphasized" in 
>> Exchange Server 2007, which means it may potentially be phased out in 
>> some future version. 
>> <http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa997614.aspx>
> 
> I know that. That's why I didn't write MAPI. But anyway, I'll probably 
> be at the launch day event on 14th January at MacWorld. I'll find out 
> then :-)

I was lucky enough to attend my first Macworld back in January. What an 
event! 2008 should be a great show for a lot of products but it will be 
quite some time before any product steals the show quite like the iPhone 
did.

-- 

bill

William M. Smith, Microsoft Interop MVP - Mac/Windows
Entourage Help Page <http://entourage.mvps.org/>
Entourage Help Blog <http://blog.entourage.mvps.org/>

Come to that, I note with concern that WebDAV is also on the list of 
"de-emphasized legacy protocols" for Exchange 2007. If Entourage 2008 will be 
dependent on WebDAV as before, then (in the eyes of an Exchange Server admin) 
the new Entourage is a legacy client before it's even code-complete. 

The disparity between Entourage and Outlook could be getting worse, not 
better. What good is a sexier Calendar if Exchange ignores your client 
altogether?


"Ian Robinson" wrote:

> On Fri, 12 Oct 2007 03:27:54 +0100, William Smith wrote
> (in article <elXF#dHDIHA.3716@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl>):
> 
> > You mean MAPI then. If that's your definition of "native" then even 
> > Exchange Server itself may not be native at some point in the future. 
> > The MAPI protocol is one of the items that has been "de-emphasized" in 
> > Exchange Server 2007, which means it may potentially be phased out in 
> > some future version. 
> > <http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa997614.aspx>
> 
> I know that. That's why I didn't write MAPI. But anyway, I'll probably 
> be at the launch day event on 14th January at MacWorld. I'll find out 
> then :-)
> 
> Ian
> -- 
> Ian Robinson, Belfast, UK
> <http://www.canicula.com/wp/>
> 
>

Jeff Clayton wrote:
> Come to that, I note with concern that WebDAV is also on the list of 
> "de-emphasized legacy protocols" for Exchange 2007. If Entourage 2008 will be 
> dependent on WebDAV as before, then (in the eyes of an Exchange Server admin) 
> the new Entourage is a legacy client before it's even code-complete. 
> 
> The disparity between Entourage and Outlook could be getting worse, not 
> better. What good is a sexier Calendar if Exchange ignores your client 
> altogether?

Very astute observation. Yes, Entourage's current and announced Exchange 
  support for Exchange Server 2007 and beyond will have to change to 
some other mechanism. Keep in mind that de-emphasized does not 
necessarily mean "dead in the next version" but I personally wouldn't 
write any code against de-emphasized methods or protocols.

To play devil's advocate, the fact that Exchange is changing in this 
manner may also mean that writing Entourage to connect may become 
easier. We'll see...

-- 

bill

William M. Smith, Microsoft Interop MVP - Mac/Windows
Entourage Help Page <http://entourage.mvps.org/>
Entourage Help Blog <http://blog.entourage.mvps.org/>

Naturally hoping that Entourage and Outlook/Exchange evolve together just as 
you say. If the news on this is going to be good, I think it odd that I 
haven't heard a whisper of it anywhere. 

From my POV, the only thing wrong with Entourage using WebDAV would be that 
it might annoy administrators who already resent Macintosh "exceptionalism." 
When actually, if the Mac client needs special handling, that is only due to 
unfortunate internal issues at Microsoft. 

-- TNX/jc


"William Smith" wrote:

> Jeff Clayton wrote:
> > Come to that, I note with concern that WebDAV is also on the list of 
> > "de-emphasized legacy protocols" for Exchange 2007. If Entourage 2008 will be 
> > dependent on WebDAV as before, then (in the eyes of an Exchange Server admin) 
> > the new Entourage is a legacy client before it's even code-complete. 
> > 
> > The disparity between Entourage and Outlook could be getting worse, not 
> > better. What good is a sexier Calendar if Exchange ignores your client 
> > altogether?
> 
> Very astute observation. Yes, Entourage's current and announced Exchange 
>   support for Exchange Server 2007 and beyond will have to change to 
> some other mechanism. Keep in mind that de-emphasized does not 
> necessarily mean "dead in the next version" but I personally wouldn't 
> write any code against de-emphasized methods or protocols.
> 
> To play devil's advocate, the fact that Exchange is changing in this 
> manner may also mean that writing Entourage to connect may become 
> easier. We'll see...
> 
> -- 
> 
> bill
> 
> William M. Smith, Microsoft Interop MVP - Mac/Windows
> Entourage Help Page <http://entourage.mvps.org/>
> Entourage Help Blog <http://blog.entourage.mvps.org/>
>

In article ,
 Jeff Clayton  wrote:

> "William Smith" wrote:
> 
> > Jeff Clayton wrote:
> > > Come to that, I note with concern that WebDAV is also on the list of 
> > > "de-emphasized legacy protocols" for Exchange 2007. If Entourage 2008 
> > > will be 
> > > dependent on WebDAV as before, then (in the eyes of an Exchange Server 
> > > admin) 
> > > the new Entourage is a legacy client before it's even code-complete. 
> > > 
> > > The disparity between Entourage and Outlook could be getting worse, not 
> > > better. What good is a sexier Calendar if Exchange ignores your client 
> > > altogether?
> > 
> > Very astute observation. Yes, Entourage's current and announced Exchange 
> >   support for Exchange Server 2007 and beyond will have to change to 
> > some other mechanism. Keep in mind that de-emphasized does not 
> > necessarily mean "dead in the next version" but I personally wouldn't 
> > write any code against de-emphasized methods or protocols.
> > 
> > To play devil's advocate, the fact that Exchange is changing in this 
> > manner may also mean that writing Entourage to connect may become 
> > easier. We'll see...
> > 
> 
> Naturally hoping that Entourage and Outlook/Exchange evolve together just as 
> you say. If the news on this is going to be good, I think it odd that I 
> haven't heard a whisper of it anywhere. 
> 
> From my POV, the only thing wrong with Entourage using WebDAV would be that 
> it might annoy administrators who already resent Macintosh "exceptionalism." 
> When actually, if the Mac client needs special handling, that is only due to 
> unfortunate internal issues at Microsoft. 

Absolutely. I would *love* to see Entourage morph into a true MAPI 
client! Maybe we'll finally see this in 2008...

-- 
Note: Please send all responses to the relevant news group. If you 
must contact me through e-mail, let me know when you send email to 
this address so that your email doesn't get eaten by my SPAM filter.

JR

Jolly Roger wrote:

> Absolutely. I would *love* to see Entourage morph into a true MAPI 
> client! Maybe we'll finally see this in 2008...

MAPI is also a de-emphasized protocol. ;-)

-- 

bill

William M. Smith, Microsoft Interop MVP - Mac/Windows
Entourage Help Page <http://entourage.mvps.org/>
Entourage Help Blog <http://blog.entourage.mvps.org/>

In article ,
 William Smith  wrote:

> Jolly Roger wrote:
> 
> > Absolutely. I would *love* to see Entourage morph into a true MAPI 
> > client! Maybe we'll finally see this in 2008...
> 
> MAPI is also a de-emphasized protocol. ;-)

I thought MAPI *was* the Exchange protocol.  No?

-- 
Note: Please send all responses to the relevant news group. If you 
must contact me through e-mail, let me know when you send email to 
this address so that your email doesn't get eaten by my SPAM filter.

JR

Nope. That was 2003, now it's Unified Communications, baby! 

See <http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa997614.aspx>. 

Although MAPI was recommended in this March article: 
<http://blogs.technet.com/sayleong/archive/2007/03/25/features-de-emphasized-and-discontinued-in-exchange-server-2007.aspx>, 
which also promises WebDAV support "through 2016."

/jc


"Jolly Roger" wrote:

> I thought MAPI *was* the Exchange protocol.  No?