On the properties page of a SMTP virtual server in Exchange 2003 SP2 there is 
a Messages tab on which is a setting named "Limit number of recipients per 
message to".  This KB article (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/821746) says 
that if this setting is used, emails that exceed the specified limit will 
result in an NDR.   But, the Exchange help file says that messages that 
exceed the limit will be resubmitted in chunks of smaller messages.

Which is true?

i think you're confusing two limits...look at the help file for "recipient 
limits"...


-- 
Susan Conkey [MVP]



"Ed Swindelles" <Ed Swindelles@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message 
news:070F961D-4CB9-4C4A-B5CE-577460E21E59@microsoft.com...
> On the properties page of a SMTP virtual server in Exchange 2003 SP2 there 
> is
> a Messages tab on which is a setting named "Limit number of recipients per
> message to".  This KB article (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/821746) 
> says
> that if this setting is used, emails that exceed the specified limit will
> result in an NDR.   But, the Exchange help file says that messages that
> exceed the limit will be resubmitted in chunks of smaller messages.
>
> Which is true?

That is exactly what I've referenced:

"You can determine the maximum number of recipients for a single message 
sent in one connection. Some clients return messages with an NDR, indicating 
that the maximum number of recipients has been exceeded. Exchange does not 
return messages in this instance. Instead it opens a new connection 
immediately and processes the remaining recipients. For example, if the 
recipient limit is set to 1,000 and a message with 1,050 recipients is 
received, the first 1,000 are delivered in one connection. Then a new 
connection is opened and the message is processed for the remaining fifty 
recipients. "

This is from the "Set Recipient Limits" section of the Exchange Server 2003 
help file and seems to contradict the above KB article.

"Susan" wrote:

> i think you're confusing two limits...look at the help file for "recipient 
> limits"...
> 
> 
> -- 
> Susan Conkey [MVP]
> 
> 
> 
> "Ed Swindelles" <Ed Swindelles@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message 
> news:070F961D-4CB9-4C4A-B5CE-577460E21E59@microsoft.com...
> > On the properties page of a SMTP virtual server in Exchange 2003 SP2 there 
> > is
> > a Messages tab on which is a setting named "Limit number of recipients per
> > message to".  This KB article (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/821746) 
> > says
> > that if this setting is used, emails that exceed the specified limit will
> > result in an NDR.   But, the Exchange help file says that messages that
> > exceed the limit will be resubmitted in chunks of smaller messages.
> >
> > Which is true? 
> 
> 
>

hmmm...if i select "help" on that tab, under Global Settings| Message 
Delivery| Defaults, I get:

Use this option to type the maximum number of recipients to whom an 
individual e-mail message can be addressed.  If a user on this server tries 
to send a message that exceeds the maximum number of recipients, it will be 
returned to the user as undeliverable..."  Not sure why it says "on this 
server" since that is a global setting...

-- 
Susan Conkey [MVP]



"Ed Swindelles"  wrote in message 
news:AE4419B1-1D36-4704-9FAD-E475CB565693@microsoft.com...
> That is exactly what I've referenced:
>
> "You can determine the maximum number of recipients for a single message
> sent in one connection. Some clients return messages with an NDR, 
> indicating
> that the maximum number of recipients has been exceeded. Exchange does not
> return messages in this instance. Instead it opens a new connection
> immediately and processes the remaining recipients. For example, if the
> recipient limit is set to 1,000 and a message with 1,050 recipients is
> received, the first 1,000 are delivered in one connection. Then a new
> connection is opened and the message is processed for the remaining fifty
> recipients. "
>
> This is from the "Set Recipient Limits" section of the Exchange Server 
> 2003
> help file and seems to contradict the above KB article.
>
> "Susan" wrote:
>
>> i think you're confusing two limits...look at the help file for 
>> "recipient
>> limits"...
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Susan Conkey [MVP]
>>
>>
>>
>> "Ed Swindelles" <Ed Swindelles@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in 
>> message
>> news:070F961D-4CB9-4C4A-B5CE-577460E21E59@microsoft.com...
>> > On the properties page of a SMTP virtual server in Exchange 2003 SP2 
>> > there
>> > is
>> > a Messages tab on which is a setting named "Limit number of recipients 
>> > per
>> > message to".  This KB article (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/821746)
>> > says
>> > that if this setting is used, emails that exceed the specified limit 
>> > will
>> > result in an NDR.   But, the Exchange help file says that messages that
>> > exceed the limit will be resubmitted in chunks of smaller messages.
>> >
>> > Which is true?
>>
>>
>>

The section that I am looking at is here:

ESM > Admin Groups > (org name) > Servers > (server name) > Protocols > SMTP 
> Default SMTP Virtual Server > Properties > Messages tab

"Susan" wrote:

> hmmm...if i select "help" on that tab, under Global Settings| Message 
> Delivery| Defaults, I get:
> 
> Use this option to type the maximum number of recipients to whom an 
> individual e-mail message can be addressed.  If a user on this server tries 
> to send a message that exceeds the maximum number of recipients, it will be 
> returned to the user as undeliverable..."  Not sure why it says "on this 
> server" since that is a global setting...
> 
> -- 
> Susan Conkey [MVP]
> 
> 
> 
> "Ed Swindelles"  wrote in message 
> news:AE4419B1-1D36-4704-9FAD-E475CB565693@microsoft.com...
> > That is exactly what I've referenced:
> >
> > "You can determine the maximum number of recipients for a single message
> > sent in one connection. Some clients return messages with an NDR, 
> > indicating
> > that the maximum number of recipients has been exceeded. Exchange does not
> > return messages in this instance. Instead it opens a new connection
> > immediately and processes the remaining recipients. For example, if the
> > recipient limit is set to 1,000 and a message with 1,050 recipients is
> > received, the first 1,000 are delivered in one connection. Then a new
> > connection is opened and the message is processed for the remaining fifty
> > recipients. "
> >
> > This is from the "Set Recipient Limits" section of the Exchange Server 
> > 2003
> > help file and seems to contradict the above KB article.
> >
> > "Susan" wrote:
> >
> >> i think you're confusing two limits...look at the help file for 
> >> "recipient
> >> limits"...
> >>
> >>
> >> -- 
> >> Susan Conkey [MVP]
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> "Ed Swindelles" <Ed Swindelles@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in 
> >> message
> >> news:070F961D-4CB9-4C4A-B5CE-577460E21E59@microsoft.com...
> >> > On the properties page of a SMTP virtual server in Exchange 2003 SP2 
> >> > there
> >> > is
> >> > a Messages tab on which is a setting named "Limit number of recipients 
> >> > per
> >> > message to".  This KB article (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/821746)
> >> > says
> >> > that if this setting is used, emails that exceed the specified limit 
> >> > will
> >> > result in an NDR.   But, the Exchange help file says that messages that
> >> > exceed the limit will be resubmitted in chunks of smaller messages.
> >> >
> >> > Which is true?
> >>
> >>
> >> 
> 
> 
>

ah...yes...I believe that's how a "connector" handles that...I had always 
set that "globally"...

-- 
Susan Conkey [MVP]



"Ed Swindelles"  wrote in message 
news:3880517B-341C-457E-B0FF-28A6ADFE3412@microsoft.com...
> The section that I am looking at is here:
>
> ESM > Admin Groups > (org name) > Servers > (server name) > Protocols > 
> SMTP
>> Default SMTP Virtual Server > Properties > Messages tab
>
> "Susan" wrote:
>
>> hmmm...if i select "help" on that tab, under Global Settings| Message
>> Delivery| Defaults, I get:
>>
>> Use this option to type the maximum number of recipients to whom an
>> individual e-mail message can be addressed.  If a user on this server 
>> tries
>> to send a message that exceeds the maximum number of recipients, it will 
>> be
>> returned to the user as undeliverable..."  Not sure why it says "on this
>> server" since that is a global setting...
>>
>> -- 
>> Susan Conkey [MVP]
>>
>>
>>
>> "Ed Swindelles"  wrote in message
>> news:AE4419B1-1D36-4704-9FAD-E475CB565693@microsoft.com...
>> > That is exactly what I've referenced:
>> >
>> > "You can determine the maximum number of recipients for a single 
>> > message
>> > sent in one connection. Some clients return messages with an NDR,
>> > indicating
>> > that the maximum number of recipients has been exceeded. Exchange does 
>> > not
>> > return messages in this instance. Instead it opens a new connection
>> > immediately and processes the remaining recipients. For example, if the
>> > recipient limit is set to 1,000 and a message with 1,050 recipients is
>> > received, the first 1,000 are delivered in one connection. Then a new
>> > connection is opened and the message is processed for the remaining 
>> > fifty
>> > recipients. "
>> >
>> > This is from the "Set Recipient Limits" section of the Exchange Server
>> > 2003
>> > help file and seems to contradict the above KB article.
>> >
>> > "Susan" wrote:
>> >
>> >> i think you're confusing two limits...look at the help file for
>> >> "recipient
>> >> limits"...
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> -- 
>> >> Susan Conkey [MVP]
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> "Ed Swindelles" <Ed Swindelles@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in
>> >> message
>> >> news:070F961D-4CB9-4C4A-B5CE-577460E21E59@microsoft.com...
>> >> > On the properties page of a SMTP virtual server in Exchange 2003 SP2
>> >> > there
>> >> > is
>> >> > a Messages tab on which is a setting named "Limit number of 
>> >> > recipients
>> >> > per
>> >> > message to".  This KB article 
>> >> > (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/821746)
>> >> > says
>> >> > that if this setting is used, emails that exceed the specified limit
>> >> > will
>> >> > result in an NDR.   But, the Exchange help file says that messages 
>> >> > that
>> >> > exceed the limit will be resubmitted in chunks of smaller messages.
>> >> >
>> >> > Which is true?
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>>
>>
>>

So, which one applies, and why do they have 2 different actions for exceeding 
the limit?

We have some messages that need to hit a large population within a single 
domain, hundreds of email addresses.  Our Exchange configuration sends the 
message fine but the receiving domain rejects it saying "too many 
recipients."  I know how many recipients they can accept in a single message. 
 So, I need to know if I set this global setting to a lower value will the 
outgoing message indeed be chunked into smaller messages, or NDR'ed.  And I 
need to know pre-implementation.  I can't test do it as a test for this 
recipient.

"Susan" wrote:

> ah...yes...I believe that's how a "connector" handles that...I had always 
> set that "globally"...
> 
> -- 
> Susan Conkey [MVP]
> 
> 
> 
> "Ed Swindelles"  wrote in message 
> news:3880517B-341C-457E-B0FF-28A6ADFE3412@microsoft.com...
> > The section that I am looking at is here:
> >
> > ESM > Admin Groups > (org name) > Servers > (server name) > Protocols > 
> > SMTP
> >> Default SMTP Virtual Server > Properties > Messages tab
> >
> > "Susan" wrote:
> >
> >> hmmm...if i select "help" on that tab, under Global Settings| Message
> >> Delivery| Defaults, I get:
> >>
> >> Use this option to type the maximum number of recipients to whom an
> >> individual e-mail message can be addressed.  If a user on this server 
> >> tries
> >> to send a message that exceeds the maximum number of recipients, it will 
> >> be
> >> returned to the user as undeliverable..."  Not sure why it says "on this
> >> server" since that is a global setting...
> >>
> >> -- 
> >> Susan Conkey [MVP]
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> "Ed Swindelles"  wrote in message
> >> news:AE4419B1-1D36-4704-9FAD-E475CB565693@microsoft.com...
> >> > That is exactly what I've referenced:
> >> >
> >> > "You can determine the maximum number of recipients for a single 
> >> > message
> >> > sent in one connection. Some clients return messages with an NDR,
> >> > indicating
> >> > that the maximum number of recipients has been exceeded. Exchange does 
> >> > not
> >> > return messages in this instance. Instead it opens a new connection
> >> > immediately and processes the remaining recipients. For example, if the
> >> > recipient limit is set to 1,000 and a message with 1,050 recipients is
> >> > received, the first 1,000 are delivered in one connection. Then a new
> >> > connection is opened and the message is processed for the remaining 
> >> > fifty
> >> > recipients. "
> >> >
> >> > This is from the "Set Recipient Limits" section of the Exchange Server
> >> > 2003
> >> > help file and seems to contradict the above KB article.
> >> >
> >> > "Susan" wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> i think you're confusing two limits...look at the help file for
> >> >> "recipient
> >> >> limits"...
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> -- 
> >> >> Susan Conkey [MVP]
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> "Ed Swindelles" <Ed Swindelles@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in
> >> >> message
> >> >> news:070F961D-4CB9-4C4A-B5CE-577460E21E59@microsoft.com...
> >> >> > On the properties page of a SMTP virtual server in Exchange 2003 SP2
> >> >> > there
> >> >> > is
> >> >> > a Messages tab on which is a setting named "Limit number of 
> >> >> > recipients
> >> >> > per
> >> >> > message to".  This KB article 
> >> >> > (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/821746)
> >> >> > says
> >> >> > that if this setting is used, emails that exceed the specified limit
> >> >> > will
> >> >> > result in an NDR.   But, the Exchange help file says that messages 
> >> >> > that
> >> >> > exceed the limit will be resubmitted in chunks of smaller messages.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Which is true?
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> 
> 
> 
>

The limit on the default smtp virtual server would affect only email going 
through that smtp virtual server...do you have only one server?  do you have 
any other limits on your smtp connector, perhaps?   But the only way to 
avoid email getting rejected by a remote server, at an external domain, 
would be to send the emails to that domain to smaller DLs (whatever their 
limit is)...The global setting affects all sent email, wherever it's 
going...and however it's being sent...

-- 
Susan Conkey [MVP]



"Ed Swindelles"  wrote in message 
news:73BBBFCE-50C5-43FB-9E9A-CD6D14D36A47@microsoft.com...
> So, which one applies, and why do they have 2 different actions for 
> exceeding
> the limit?
>
> We have some messages that need to hit a large population within a single
> domain, hundreds of email addresses.  Our Exchange configuration sends the
> message fine but the receiving domain rejects it saying "too many
> recipients."  I know how many recipients they can accept in a single 
> message.
> So, I need to know if I set this global setting to a lower value will the
> outgoing message indeed be chunked into smaller messages, or NDR'ed.  And 
> I
> need to know pre-implementation.  I can't test do it as a test for this
> recipient.
>
> "Susan" wrote:
>
>> ah...yes...I believe that's how a "connector" handles that...I had always
>> set that "globally"...
>>
>> -- 
>> Susan Conkey [MVP]
>>
>>
>>
>> "Ed Swindelles"  wrote in message
>> news:3880517B-341C-457E-B0FF-28A6ADFE3412@microsoft.com...
>> > The section that I am looking at is here:
>> >
>> > ESM > Admin Groups > (org name) > Servers > (server name) > Protocols >
>> > SMTP
>> >> Default SMTP Virtual Server > Properties > Messages tab
>> >
>> > "Susan" wrote:
>> >
>> >> hmmm...if i select "help" on that tab, under Global Settings| Message
>> >> Delivery| Defaults, I get:
>> >>
>> >> Use this option to type the maximum number of recipients to whom an
>> >> individual e-mail message can be addressed.  If a user on this server
>> >> tries
>> >> to send a message that exceeds the maximum number of recipients, it 
>> >> will
>> >> be
>> >> returned to the user as undeliverable..."  Not sure why it says "on 
>> >> this
>> >> server" since that is a global setting...
>> >>
>> >> -- 
>> >> Susan Conkey [MVP]
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> "Ed Swindelles"  wrote in 
>> >> message
>> >> news:AE4419B1-1D36-4704-9FAD-E475CB565693@microsoft.com...
>> >> > That is exactly what I've referenced:
>> >> >
>> >> > "You can determine the maximum number of recipients for a single
>> >> > message
>> >> > sent in one connection. Some clients return messages with an NDR,
>> >> > indicating
>> >> > that the maximum number of recipients has been exceeded. Exchange 
>> >> > does
>> >> > not
>> >> > return messages in this instance. Instead it opens a new connection
>> >> > immediately and processes the remaining recipients. For example, if 
>> >> > the
>> >> > recipient limit is set to 1,000 and a message with 1,050 recipients 
>> >> > is
>> >> > received, the first 1,000 are delivered in one connection. Then a 
>> >> > new
>> >> > connection is opened and the message is processed for the remaining
>> >> > fifty
>> >> > recipients. "
>> >> >
>> >> > This is from the "Set Recipient Limits" section of the Exchange 
>> >> > Server
>> >> > 2003
>> >> > help file and seems to contradict the above KB article.
>> >> >
>> >> > "Susan" wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> >> i think you're confusing two limits...look at the help file for
>> >> >> "recipient
>> >> >> limits"...
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> -- 
>> >> >> Susan Conkey [MVP]
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> "Ed Swindelles" <Ed Swindelles@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in
>> >> >> message
>> >> >> news:070F961D-4CB9-4C4A-B5CE-577460E21E59@microsoft.com...
>> >> >> > On the properties page of a SMTP virtual server in Exchange 2003 
>> >> >> > SP2
>> >> >> > there
>> >> >> > is
>> >> >> > a Messages tab on which is a setting named "Limit number of
>> >> >> > recipients
>> >> >> > per
>> >> >> > message to".  This KB article
>> >> >> > (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/821746)
>> >> >> > says
>> >> >> > that if this setting is used, emails that exceed the specified 
>> >> >> > limit
>> >> >> > will
>> >> >> > result in an NDR.   But, the Exchange help file says that 
>> >> >> > messages
>> >> >> > that
>> >> >> > exceed the limit will be resubmitted in chunks of smaller 
>> >> >> > messages.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Which is true?
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>>
>>
>>

There are multiple servers with SMTP.  So, is the following true? : The 
global setting, if exceeded, will result in an NDR.  The SMTP virtual server 
level setting, if exceeded, will result in the message being chunked.  If so, 
under what circumstance, then, would the latter setting apply?

"Susan" wrote:

> The limit on the default smtp virtual server would affect only email going 
> through that smtp virtual server...do you have only one server?  do you have 
> any other limits on your smtp connector, perhaps?   But the only way to 
> avoid email getting rejected by a remote server, at an external domain, 
> would be to send the emails to that domain to smaller DLs (whatever their 
> limit is)...The global setting affects all sent email, wherever it's 
> going...and however it's being sent...
> 
> -- 
> Susan Conkey [MVP]
> 
> 
> 
> "Ed Swindelles"  wrote in message 
> news:73BBBFCE-50C5-43FB-9E9A-CD6D14D36A47@microsoft.com...
> > So, which one applies, and why do they have 2 different actions for 
> > exceeding
> > the limit?
> >
> > We have some messages that need to hit a large population within a single
> > domain, hundreds of email addresses.  Our Exchange configuration sends the
> > message fine but the receiving domain rejects it saying "too many
> > recipients."  I know how many recipients they can accept in a single 
> > message.
> > So, I need to know if I set this global setting to a lower value will the
> > outgoing message indeed be chunked into smaller messages, or NDR'ed.  And 
> > I
> > need to know pre-implementation.  I can't test do it as a test for this
> > recipient.
> >
> > "Susan" wrote:
> >
> >> ah...yes...I believe that's how a "connector" handles that...I had always
> >> set that "globally"...
> >>
> >> -- 
> >> Susan Conkey [MVP]
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> "Ed Swindelles"  wrote in message
> >> news:3880517B-341C-457E-B0FF-28A6ADFE3412@microsoft.com...
> >> > The section that I am looking at is here:
> >> >
> >> > ESM > Admin Groups > (org name) > Servers > (server name) > Protocols >
> >> > SMTP
> >> >> Default SMTP Virtual Server > Properties > Messages tab
> >> >
> >> > "Susan" wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> hmmm...if i select "help" on that tab, under Global Settings| Message
> >> >> Delivery| Defaults, I get:
> >> >>
> >> >> Use this option to type the maximum number of recipients to whom an
> >> >> individual e-mail message can be addressed.  If a user on this server
> >> >> tries
> >> >> to send a message that exceeds the maximum number of recipients, it 
> >> >> will
> >> >> be
> >> >> returned to the user as undeliverable..."  Not sure why it says "on 
> >> >> this
> >> >> server" since that is a global setting...
> >> >>
> >> >> -- 
> >> >> Susan Conkey [MVP]
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> "Ed Swindelles"  wrote in 
> >> >> message
> >> >> news:AE4419B1-1D36-4704-9FAD-E475CB565693@microsoft.com...
> >> >> > That is exactly what I've referenced:
> >> >> >
> >> >> > "You can determine the maximum number of recipients for a single
> >> >> > message
> >> >> > sent in one connection. Some clients return messages with an NDR,
> >> >> > indicating
> >> >> > that the maximum number of recipients has been exceeded. Exchange 
> >> >> > does
> >> >> > not
> >> >> > return messages in this instance. Instead it opens a new connection
> >> >> > immediately and processes the remaining recipients. For example, if 
> >> >> > the
> >> >> > recipient limit is set to 1,000 and a message with 1,050 recipients 
> >> >> > is
> >> >> > received, the first 1,000 are delivered in one connection. Then a 
> >> >> > new
> >> >> > connection is opened and the message is processed for the remaining
> >> >> > fifty
> >> >> > recipients. "
> >> >> >
> >> >> > This is from the "Set Recipient Limits" section of the Exchange 
> >> >> > Server
> >> >> > 2003
> >> >> > help file and seems to contradict the above KB article.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > "Susan" wrote:
> >> >> >
> >> >> >> i think you're confusing two limits...look at the help file for
> >> >> >> "recipient
> >> >> >> limits"...
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> -- 
> >> >> >> Susan Conkey [MVP]
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> "Ed Swindelles" <Ed Swindelles@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in
> >> >> >> message
> >> >> >> news:070F961D-4CB9-4C4A-B5CE-577460E21E59@microsoft.com...
> >> >> >> > On the properties page of a SMTP virtual server in Exchange 2003 
> >> >> >> > SP2
> >> >> >> > there
> >> >> >> > is
> >> >> >> > a Messages tab on which is a setting named "Limit number of
> >> >> >> > recipients
> >> >> >> > per
> >> >> >> > message to".  This KB article
> >> >> >> > (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/821746)
> >> >> >> > says
> >> >> >> > that if this setting is used, emails that exceed the specified 
> >> >> >> > limit
> >> >> >> > will
> >> >> >> > result in an NDR.   But, the Exchange help file says that 
> >> >> >> > messages
> >> >> >> > that
> >> >> >> > exceed the limit will be resubmitted in chunks of smaller 
> >> >> >> > messages.
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> > Which is true?
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> 
> 
> 
>

My guess would be that if you set the global setting to be 2000 recipients, 
any email that anyone in the org would try to send to 2001+ recipients would 
generate an NDR...It appears that the setting on the smtp virtual server 
applies to outgoing and incoming messages, so that would probably be the 
difference...

-- 
Susan Conkey [MVP]



"Ed Swindelles"  wrote in message 
news:4784500D-287B-4B2C-B6D3-B51E8C3E6FFC@microsoft.com...
> There are multiple servers with SMTP.  So, is the following true? : The
> global setting, if exceeded, will result in an NDR.  The SMTP virtual 
> server
> level setting, if exceeded, will result in the message being chunked.  If 
> so,
> under what circumstance, then, would the latter setting apply?
>
> "Susan" wrote:
>
>> The limit on the default smtp virtual server would affect only email 
>> going
>> through that smtp virtual server...do you have only one server?  do you 
>> have
>> any other limits on your smtp connector, perhaps?   But the only way to
>> avoid email getting rejected by a remote server, at an external domain,
>> would be to send the emails to that domain to smaller DLs (whatever their
>> limit is)...The global setting affects all sent email, wherever it's
>> going...and however it's being sent...
>>
>> -- 
>> Susan Conkey [MVP]
>>
>>
>>
>> "Ed Swindelles"  wrote in message
>> news:73BBBFCE-50C5-43FB-9E9A-CD6D14D36A47@microsoft.com...
>> > So, which one applies, and why do they have 2 different actions for
>> > exceeding
>> > the limit?
>> >
>> > We have some messages that need to hit a large population within a 
>> > single
>> > domain, hundreds of email addresses.  Our Exchange configuration sends 
>> > the
>> > message fine but the receiving domain rejects it saying "too many
>> > recipients."  I know how many recipients they can accept in a single
>> > message.
>> > So, I need to know if I set this global setting to a lower value will 
>> > the
>> > outgoing message indeed be chunked into smaller messages, or NDR'ed. 
>> > And
>> > I
>> > need to know pre-implementation.  I can't test do it as a test for this
>> > recipient.
>> >
>> > "Susan" wrote:
>> >
>> >> ah...yes...I believe that's how a "connector" handles that...I had 
>> >> always
>> >> set that "globally"...
>> >>
>> >> -- 
>> >> Susan Conkey [MVP]
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> "Ed Swindelles"  wrote in 
>> >> message
>> >> news:3880517B-341C-457E-B0FF-28A6ADFE3412@microsoft.com...
>> >> > The section that I am looking at is here:
>> >> >
>> >> > ESM > Admin Groups > (org name) > Servers > (server name) > 
>> >> > Protocols >
>> >> > SMTP
>> >> >> Default SMTP Virtual Server > Properties > Messages tab
>> >> >
>> >> > "Susan" wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> >> hmmm...if i select "help" on that tab, under Global Settings| 
>> >> >> Message
>> >> >> Delivery| Defaults, I get:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Use this option to type the maximum number of recipients to whom an
>> >> >> individual e-mail message can be addressed.  If a user on this 
>> >> >> server
>> >> >> tries
>> >> >> to send a message that exceeds the maximum number of recipients, it
>> >> >> will
>> >> >> be
>> >> >> returned to the user as undeliverable..."  Not sure why it says "on
>> >> >> this
>> >> >> server" since that is a global setting...
>> >> >>
>> >> >> -- 
>> >> >> Susan Conkey [MVP]
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> "Ed Swindelles"  wrote in
>> >> >> message
>> >> >> news:AE4419B1-1D36-4704-9FAD-E475CB565693@microsoft.com...
>> >> >> > That is exactly what I've referenced:
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > "You can determine the maximum number of recipients for a single
>> >> >> > message
>> >> >> > sent in one connection. Some clients return messages with an NDR,
>> >> >> > indicating
>> >> >> > that the maximum number of recipients has been exceeded. Exchange
>> >> >> > does
>> >> >> > not
>> >> >> > return messages in this instance. Instead it opens a new 
>> >> >> > connection
>> >> >> > immediately and processes the remaining recipients. For example, 
>> >> >> > if
>> >> >> > the
>> >> >> > recipient limit is set to 1,000 and a message with 1,050 
>> >> >> > recipients
>> >> >> > is
>> >> >> > received, the first 1,000 are delivered in one connection. Then a
>> >> >> > new
>> >> >> > connection is opened and the message is processed for the 
>> >> >> > remaining
>> >> >> > fifty
>> >> >> > recipients. "
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > This is from the "Set Recipient Limits" section of the Exchange
>> >> >> > Server
>> >> >> > 2003
>> >> >> > help file and seems to contradict the above KB article.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > "Susan" wrote:
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> i think you're confusing two limits...look at the help file for
>> >> >> >> "recipient
>> >> >> >> limits"...
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> -- 
>> >> >> >> Susan Conkey [MVP]
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> "Ed Swindelles" <Ed Swindelles@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote 
>> >> >> >> in
>> >> >> >> message
>> >> >> >> news:070F961D-4CB9-4C4A-B5CE-577460E21E59@microsoft.com...
>> >> >> >> > On the properties page of a SMTP virtual server in Exchange 
>> >> >> >> > 2003
>> >> >> >> > SP2
>> >> >> >> > there
>> >> >> >> > is
>> >> >> >> > a Messages tab on which is a setting named "Limit number of
>> >> >> >> > recipients
>> >> >> >> > per
>> >> >> >> > message to".  This KB article
>> >> >> >> > (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/821746)
>> >> >> >> > says
>> >> >> >> > that if this setting is used, emails that exceed the specified
>> >> >> >> > limit
>> >> >> >> > will
>> >> >> >> > result in an NDR.   But, the Exchange help file says that
>> >> >> >> > messages
>> >> >> >> > that
>> >> >> >> > exceed the limit will be resubmitted in chunks of smaller
>> >> >> >> > messages.
>> >> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> > Which is true?
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>>
>>
>>

Does anyone have any concrete data on these settings?  We need to send email 
to a large audience at a single domain using one distribution list.  And we 
need that email to not exceed the target domain's limit by splitting the 
email into multiple connections. 

"Ed Swindelles" wrote:

> On the properties page of a SMTP virtual server in Exchange 2003 SP2 there is 
> a Messages tab on which is a setting named "Limit number of recipients per 
> message to".  This KB article (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/821746) says 
> that if this setting is used, emails that exceed the specified limit will 
> result in an NDR.   But, the Exchange help file says that messages that 
> exceed the limit will be resubmitted in chunks of smaller messages.
> 
> Which is true?

rOn Tue, 9 Sep 2008 11:28:11 -0700, Ed Swindelles
 wrote:

>Does anyone have any concrete data on these settings?  

The value you specify in the SMTP Virtual Server controls the maximum
number of RCPT TO commands that are allowed in a single SMTP session
(with an external server -- this limit doesn't apply to RGC
connections). Setting it to a value of 100 is acceptable and 100 is
the smallest allowed number of RCPT TO commands allowed by RFC821. In
earlier releases of Exchange (E2K, for example) there was some
confusion and this value was not only applied to RGC connections but
it was also taken to be the maximum number of recipients allowed in a
message (as measured by RCPT TO commands) and exceeding that value
would NDR the message (with 5xx status, not the expected 4xx status)
for the number of RCPT TO commands in excess of the value. That was
fixed years ago. Today that value is correctly used to send 4xx status
codes for RCPT TO command in excess of the value or to split a single
message with more than "X" number of recipient into multiple SMTP
sessions, none of which will send more than "X" number of RCPT TO
commands.

The value you set in the Message Delivery Properties applies only to
messages sent by someone in your organization. The value prevents the
number of recipients (which are counted AFTER Distribution Group
expansion!) on a message from exceeding this value. This value has
nothing to do with the number of RCPT TO commands allowed in a single
SMTP session.

>We need to send email 
>to a large audience at a single domain using one distribution list.  And we 
>need that email to not exceed the target domain's limit by splitting the 
>email into multiple connections. 

You MAY have to worry about that but it's not something you can know
in advance. It's certainly a good idea to NOT send email with hundreds
or thousands, of addresses in the TO: and CC: headers.

You SHOULD consider that the receiving MTA may have its own limit on
the number of RCPT TO commands it will accept in a single session. You
server, if left unrestrained, will send ALL of the recipients in the
first SMTP session and MAY receive a 4xx status for each of them in
excess of the other MTAs limit. That will cause your server to retry
the message for the recipients that received the 4xx status. If you
have 1000 recipients in the meesage, and the other MTA only allows 100
RCPT TO commands in a session then you'll send a total of 1000 + 900 +
800 + 700 + 600 + 500 + 400 + 300 + 100 = 5,500 RCPT TO commands over
ten message retries. If you restrict YOUR MTA to sending only 100 RCPT
TO commands per session you'd have sent just 1,000 RCPT TO commands in
ten retries.
---
Rich Matheisen
MCSE+I, Exchange MVP

Thank you for the detailed response.  I do happen to know the target domain's 
maximum receive size - 600.  So, I will set our limit to something lower, say 
500, and test it.

"Rich Matheisen [MVP]" wrote:

> rOn Tue, 9 Sep 2008 11:28:11 -0700, Ed Swindelles
>  wrote:
> 
> >Does anyone have any concrete data on these settings?  
> 
> The value you specify in the SMTP Virtual Server controls the maximum
> number of RCPT TO commands that are allowed in a single SMTP session
> (with an external server -- this limit doesn't apply to RGC
> connections). Setting it to a value of 100 is acceptable and 100 is
> the smallest allowed number of RCPT TO commands allowed by RFC821. In
> earlier releases of Exchange (E2K, for example) there was some
> confusion and this value was not only applied to RGC connections but
> it was also taken to be the maximum number of recipients allowed in a
> message (as measured by RCPT TO commands) and exceeding that value
> would NDR the message (with 5xx status, not the expected 4xx status)
> for the number of RCPT TO commands in excess of the value. That was
> fixed years ago. Today that value is correctly used to send 4xx status
> codes for RCPT TO command in excess of the value or to split a single
> message with more than "X" number of recipient into multiple SMTP
> sessions, none of which will send more than "X" number of RCPT TO
> commands.
> 
> The value you set in the Message Delivery Properties applies only to
> messages sent by someone in your organization. The value prevents the
> number of recipients (which are counted AFTER Distribution Group
> expansion!) on a message from exceeding this value. This value has
> nothing to do with the number of RCPT TO commands allowed in a single
> SMTP session.
> 
> >We need to send email 
> >to a large audience at a single domain using one distribution list.  And we 
> >need that email to not exceed the target domain's limit by splitting the 
> >email into multiple connections. 
> 
> You MAY have to worry about that but it's not something you can know
> in advance. It's certainly a good idea to NOT send email with hundreds
> or thousands, of addresses in the TO: and CC: headers.
> 
> You SHOULD consider that the receiving MTA may have its own limit on
> the number of RCPT TO commands it will accept in a single session. You
> server, if left unrestrained, will send ALL of the recipients in the
> first SMTP session and MAY receive a 4xx status for each of them in
> excess of the other MTAs limit. That will cause your server to retry
> the message for the recipients that received the 4xx status. If you
> have 1000 recipients in the meesage, and the other MTA only allows 100
> RCPT TO commands in a session then you'll send a total of 1000 + 900 +
> 800 + 700 + 600 + 500 + 400 + 300 + 100 = 5,500 RCPT TO commands over
> ten message retries. If you restrict YOUR MTA to sending only 100 RCPT
> TO commands per session you'd have sent just 1,000 RCPT TO commands in
> ten retries.
> ---
> Rich Matheisen
> MCSE+I, Exchange MVP
>

On Sep 9, 8:51 pm, "Rich Matheisen [MVP]"
 wrote:

Above you stated:

> The value you specify in the SMTP Virtual Server controls the maximum
> number of RCPT TO commands that are allowed in a single SMTP session

> The value you set in the Message Delivery Properties applies only to
> messages sent by someone in your organization. The value prevents the
> number of recipients (which are counted AFTER Distribution Group
> expansion!) on a message from exceeding this value. This value has
> nothing to do with the number of RCPT TO commands allowed in a single
> SMTP session.

Which now has me confused about which settings are which.  I am
wondering if the value set in the SMTP Virtual Server's Properties on
the Message Tab via the "Limit Number of recipients per message" box.
Is this the value that controls the number of RCPT To commands or is
this "the value you set in the Message Delivery Properties"  Also what
exactly constitues an "SMTP Session".  Is it an attempt to send a
generated message that has been dropped in the queue?  Or is it the
effort of sending all the messages in the queue.  I am required by our
government sponsor to periodically send out a couple of thousand
generated emails with attgachment to our list of users and the effort
usually ends up choaking our SMTP user.  I was hoping that grouping
many recipients per email message might allieviate some of the strain,
but it sounds like and logically makes sense that the same number of
outgoing entitiies will be attempted to be sent regardless of whether
the recipients are grouped on the message or not.

On Mon, 29 Sep 2008 13:05:29 -0700 (PDT), vbnetman6@gmail.com wrote:

>On Sep 9, 8:51 pm, "Rich Matheisen [MVP]"
> wrote:
>
>Above you stated:
>
>> The value you specify in the SMTP Virtual Server controls the maximum
>> number of RCPT TO commands that are allowed in a single SMTP session
>
>> The value you set in the Message Delivery Properties applies only to
>> messages sent by someone in your organization. The value prevents the
>> number of recipients (which are counted AFTER Distribution Group
>> expansion!) on a message from exceeding this value. This value has
>> nothing to do with the number of RCPT TO commands allowed in a single
>> SMTP session.
>
>Which now has me confused about which settings are which.  I am
>wondering if the value set in the SMTP Virtual Server's Properties on
>the Message Tab via the "Limit Number of recipients per message" box.
>Is this the value that controls the number of RCPT To commands 

Yes.

>or is
>this "the value you set in the Message Delivery Properties"  Also what
>exactly constitues an "SMTP Session".  

"Session" should have said "message". RCPT TO commands are applicable
only to a single message.

>Is it an attempt to send a
>generated message that has been dropped in the queue?  Or is it the
>effort of sending all the messages in the queue.  I am required by our
>government sponsor to periodically send out a couple of thousand
>generated emails with attgachment to our list of users and the effort
>usually ends up choaking our SMTP user.  I was hoping that grouping
>many recipients per email message might allieviate some of the strain,

Only if they're all in the same domain. But the assumption is that
you're sending one message with many recipients and not one message to
each of many recipients.

>but it sounds like and logically makes sense that the same number of
>outgoing entitiies will be attempted to be sent regardless of whether
>the recipients are grouped on the message or not.

If you send one message to each recipient then you'll send a lot of
individual messages. If you send one message to many recipients you'll
send one message to each domain (or possibly more, depending on the
number of recipients in the same domain and your host's and the
receiving host's limit on the number of RCPT TO commands allowed per
message).
---
Rich Matheisen
MCSE+I, Exchange MVP